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Episode 6
Go-to Strategies for Crisis Communications
About This Episode
We examine important distinctions between brand and crisis communications, and offer tips on how agencies can communicate a brand’s message during a time of crisis.
Lanny Cardow | VP, Head of Digital Strategy, NATIONAL Public Relations
Brandon Langevin | Senior Sales Director, StackAdapt
Amika Evans | Sales Director, StackAdapt
Transcript
Episode Introduction (00:00:00)
Even within this month, you know, we’ve seen a lot of change. And you can say it’s happening every day. But it’s one of the incredible risk and danger for brands right now. We’re communicating, it’s certainly not an all or nothing. There’s no easy way to say, you know, don’t do this rebars. But it’s what were mindful. This is essential mindfulness of tone, mindfulness, public anxiety, mindfulness to where people’s heads are at right now. We subscribe to the Angus Reed daily tracker, which is a wonderful email product, by the way. And the latest one said that 64% of Canadians in their panels said it was important to advertise right now. Now, does that mean that 64% of people are going to take up pitchforks? No, of course not. They see 1000s of ads a day and people might even remember some of them. But it’s, it certainly means that there’s a strong vigilance in the public right now.
How Agencies Thrive Introduction (00:01:00)
Curious to know what industry leading marketers are looking to achieve and the ever evolving digital landscape to How Agencies Thrive podcast by StackAdapt is dedicated to helping the new breed of forward thinking savvy, lean and mean marketers win in the rapidly evolving digital landscape. Time to thrive.
Vitaly (00:01:29)
Thanks for joining us today. My name is Vitaly, and I’m the host of this podcast. This episode is going to be all about public relations and crisis communication. I’ve really liked the way Lanny explained the difference between advocacy communication and brand communication work, what I learned is that there’s a big opportunity for brands to align their messaging around some key trends and fundamental industry shifts. Ultimately, using this advocacy as a thought leadership tool can be a very strong vehicle to build brand awareness. Additionally, what I like about this episode is the very tactical know how on how to be in market during sensitive times, and how to navigate challenging times to build stronger relationships with consumers. Now it’s done to get some deeper insights from our guests for today’s episode, Lanny Cardow, from NATIONAL PR.
Brandon (00:02:14)
Well, thank you everybody, for joining and listening to StackAdapt Podcast. Today. We’ll start by introducing both hosts. My name is Brandon, and I’m one of our sales directors at StackAdapt. So my role is primarily overseeing the digital media strategy and execution across one of our sales teams. And I’m joined by my partner in crime, Amika.
Amika (00:02:35)
Yes. Thank you, Brandon. My name is Amika Evans, and I’m an account director at StackAdapt. And my role primarily is to be of assistance and work very closely with our clients.
Brandon (00:02:47)
Lastly, we’re joined by our guest today, Lanny Cardow, who’s the Vice President and head of digital media strategy at NATIONAL Public Relations in Toronto. So Lanie, let’s start by talking about yourself a little bit. Why don’t you let everybody know what you do? How long you’ve worked in the industry, and what you would consider your strongest area of expertise?
Lanny (00:03:05)
Sure. Well, first of all, thank you very much for for having me on today. And we’re looking forward to this. And I really looking forward to our chat. So to your question, I guess I come from a bit of a political background myself, I was kind of a political staffer before I was involved in. In digital communications, I was a early adopter, you might say, of bringing digital technologies to politics, I was working on the conservative side of the fence back then in Canadian politics. And I think it was just a matter of good timing more than anything, just being a young staffer bit nerdy, perhaps, who understood the tools that were available at a time when they were just coming online and, and figuring out a way to incorporate those into work as a political staffer in Ottawa, and did that for a lot of years, actually, and didn’t move into private sector communications until doing that for quite a while. And I made that jump into more of a public affairs style effect communications firms for quite a while. And using those same kinds of digital skills in that context for client services in that way. And then a roundabout long way, maybe a couple more detours and stops in Ottawa and Washington DC along the way, and ultimately ended up arriving at National Public Relations here at Toronto, big agency for the first time in my life and my career, and using those same kinds of digital tools as they exist now and 2020. The world’s changed a lot since since I started but in this stuff, but it’s, it’s exciting.
Amika (00:04:39)
Yes, absolutely. Thank you for that rundown, Lani. It’s very cool that you started off in politics and now you are the digital guru that I know you to be.
Lanny (00:04:51)
You never really leave politics. It’s like Hotel California, right? You check out but you never leave. So you always keep one foot in it and you know, you might get the phone call Call now and then to to help out this thing or that thing. So it’s, it’s kind of a lifetime. lifetime deal, I think.
Amika (00:05:08)
Fantastic. So I like to get to know just for listeners, you know, just a little bit about, you know, what are you up to a national PR day in the life of yourself or your colleagues?
Lanny (00:05:19)
Sure, absolutely. Well, it’s been, it’s been one heck of a fast year. And my one year anniversary at the firm, I think happened just as, as the world was in its last week of kind of operating normally about a month ago, this being recorded in April, we, you know, as I mentioned, it’s my first time working largely, and this is an eye opening experience. The team is absolutely fantastic that I lead here at this at this office, the length of national might be similar to that of the other big agencies in the sense that, you know, it’s a fast buzzing place. There’s a lot of people, I’ve been to your office before mica, and it’s kind of a similar vibe, as you guys haven’t StackAdapt You know, this big open concept office, everyone works in everyone works in practice areas, everyone is, you know, well, I mean, from my perspective, it seems like everyone’s so young. But they’re, you know, they’re least in the digital team. They are and extremely tech savvy, very, very fast workers. Everyone just does remarkable amount of work in a day. And everyone’s it’s it’s quite services. And so everyone, everyone has a variety of different clients that that they’re working for at any given point in time. Most of our team is specialized in the sense that we have people that work a little bit more on the content side of the spectrum, people that work more on the technical side, ad buying, SEO, SEM, that kind of work. And then we have people who, who specialize more in certain types of work, maybe more brand communications, maybe more. On the side of Public Affairs and Advocacy work, which we don’t we’re gonna get around to talking about today. It’s so it’s, so it’s a big office. And you know, one of the nice things about working in digital and the way we’ve structured our team at national and certainly the way that other firms have tended to be doing this as well, is we use the digital team as a bit of a hub that serves the whole organization, when you have a little cluster of specialized skills like that, one of the ways a lot of the same way that people structure creative teams, in agencies as well. Whether it’s our Capital Markets team, or whether it’s our healthcare team, or whether it’s a consumer team, they can draw upon the skills, the specialized skills with the digital team to build into their work, because it’s pretty rare in 2020, that you don’t have an RFP or an engagement of some sort that doesn’t require digital in some way, shape, or form, whether it’s a content calendar, or advertising or, or maybe something else all together, but so we sort of, we sort of operate as this little hub, what it means for us is that day to day, no two days or like, it means we get a really wide variety of clients, we get to work on in digital, which is really fun. In addition to that, it makes you a better consultant. Because when you have, you know, a dozen different client clients to serve, you learn a lot about the different kinds of needs that are out there, and you get a chance to try everything. So it’s nice.
Brandon (00:08:21)
Yeah, absolutely. And we both really appreciate the insight there. And we’re both curious, we want to get your take on it. Given your long history in both the political and public relations space. Let’s talk about it a little bit. So from your perspective, and you mentioned it a little bit earlier for you, what do you think is kind of the biggest difference between crisis communication versus brand communication? Or like you mentioned, more advocacy work versus brand work? And is the one you prefer doing? Or how differently do yourself and your team approach each of those scenarios?
Lanny (00:08:59)
Oh, those are great questions. And I look forward to getting into those. So I mean, this is this has been one of the biggest changes moving out of that political space and into a firm that, you know, involves clients that involve everything from, you know, food and beverage, to consumer goods to personal care and beauty, like, the last year I’ve spent with some really interesting, different kinds of clients that I’ve never had before. And so I’m starting to have a much better understanding of the way to answer this question than I had before. And, you know, my current, you know, we never play favorites with clients, but one of the one that I’m absolutely having the most fun on right now is is a major food and food producer. In the end it’s completely consumer work and not a shred of it is political. And it’s a it’s just unbelievably fun. So, I guess brand and advocacy, I guess as a distinction between the two. Some people like to say that brand communications, it’s almost like a very strictly aligned one way sort of offering. It’s a lot of about consistency and repetition and, and keeping things together in the sense of what you’re what you’re saying all given times, advocacy, I likened to thinking more like a two way dialogue, or actually better described, like maybe more of a 360 degree view. So you might, you might want to be comfortable when you’re doing advocacy, communications, entertaining dialogue around an issue, including voices that aren’t necessarily yours, perhaps you’re bringing in third party speakers, you know, maybe maybe external advocates, you’re, you’re trying to have that entire conversation. So I mean, you know, if I was going to, if I was going to just make a really gross oversimplification, you know, that brand version of the communication might be download our healthcare app, and the advocacy version of that might be learned about how apps will drive the future of self service in healthcare or something like that. So again, you’re it’s more of a, you know, accuracies involving a lot of thought leadership these days, it’s involving a lot of, to engagement with on a topic, and you have to be willing to have it get a little bit messy at times, whereas I think of, I often think of communications as very streamlined, consistent, orchestrated, but more one way in nature, I don’t know if that’s making any sense. But that’s, that’s one way to think about it. Another and maybe just another short version, you know, a mentor of mine once said that, in brand communications, you want the categories to succeed. But in advocacy, communications is a lot more of a zero sum game in the sense that there’s an app and you you need something of whether it’s government or, or some target like that, and it is very much a zero sum in its competitive environment. Whereas in brand, you want the category to succeed, you don’t want the category to fail.
Amika (00:11:47)
Yeah, that’s a very good way of putting it. I’m Lenny. So I think for myself, I’ve learned a lot just between brand communication, advocacy, communications from that realm. So thank you just wanted to dive into our next question. And, you know, it’s kind of a good segue, actually. So given the current circumstances, in your opinion, how should brands be shifting their message accordingly? And is it okay to keep pushing your product? I’m also interested in your opinion, you know, because I caught wind of a campaign that ran in for McDonald’s in Brazil. So I’m interested in your opinion on how major brands have reacted so far outside of that, and with that one as well.
Lanny (00:12:27)
Oh, absolutely. And so, you know, it merits saying that we’re recording this in mid April. And so we’re, you know, we’re a month into this new world right now. And even within this month, you know, we’ve seen a lot of change. And you can say it’s happening every day. But it’s one of the incredible risk and danger for brands right now. We’re communicating, it’s certainly not an all or nothing. II, there’s no easy way to say, you know, don’t do this rebars. But it’s what were mindful. This is essential mindfulness of tone, mindfulness to the public’s anxiety, that mindfulness to where people’s heads are at right now. We subscribe to the Angus Reed daily tracker, which is a wonderful email product, by the way. And the latest one said that 64% of Canadians in their panel said it was important to advertise right now. Now, does that mean that 64% of people are going to take up pitchforks? No, of course not. They see 1000s of ads a day, and people might even remember some of them. But it’s, it certainly means that there’s a strong vigilance in the public right now about what’s being perceived to be, quote, unquote, you know, opportunistic, which is, you know, a huge red flag right now or, or insensitive to that move. So, I think it’s, it’s going to be risky. It’s not to say that it’s it’s not to say that you should, it’s not to say that everyone should, because, you know, while you still have to do both things that I mentioned, Tony, and also the most, I mean, you know, showing an ad with a large crowd of people right now, even if you shot that ad, you know, last year, it still looks weird in the context where we’re getting messages from our health officials and government saying, Don’t congregate, don’t socialize in groups, it would be strange, and we look inappropriate to have an ad that had that kind of visual. So again, mindfulness, but let’s say you were a manufacturer of at home exercise equipment or something, right. I mean, this is your time to shine in the sense that there’s a massive and surging demand for what you’re making. Does it mean that you have to completely you know, opt out of out of advertising at this moment when people are in fact searching for your product? No, it doesn’t, but it does mean that you have to be especially sensitive it does mean that you don’t have you know, a Corona sale right now, you know, it doesn’t, it means that you have to be sensitive to the fact that you know, maybe you should play this one a little more flat not equally. Be careful about your about what you might think might be a creative and fun way to build off If this situation is probably not, people will probably react negatively if you get too cute if it’s too on the nose. So I would say that, you know, you have to, you have to just be extremely cautious, but recognizing that there are people that have to advertise right now. And while some campaigns might be better to defer delay, or alter, in some way, shape, or form or move, you know, move budgets here and there. It’s certainly a big red stop sign for everybody.
Brandon (00:15:29)
Yeah, thanks a lot, Lanny. And I think something we’ve done as well, from StackAdapt approach to handling how you know, brands are changing their messaging appropriately. We’ve had a lot of our clients come come up to us and ask us what what should they do. And I think, you know, although there is some, some small variance by vertical, ultimately, our message is remaining the same, where if you are going to continue to advertise more than anything, be genuine, be empathetic, and be tactful, and you know, if your brand is continuing to run, if you are an essential service, help your consumers, update them on your supply chain, let them know how you can continue consuming an essential product from the safety of your home as opposed to being tone deaf. And, you know, just trying to sell people new banking credit cards at a time where not only is it a social pandemic, you know, we’re kind of on the verge of another financial crisis where the markets are equally down, in part as a result of this. So just from from StackAdapt point of view, and we actually had a webinar about this last week, not only talking about the digital media trends we’re seeing as a result of this, but ultimately, you know, it’s more than ever, the right time to be genuine, and just be empathetic and mindful to who you’re speaking to. Because, like you said, there’s a lot of people who are saying you shouldn’t be advertising at all. But ultimately, we know that’s not going to be the case. So if you are going to continue to advertise, be mindful of how you’re communicating your message and alter it in a way that’s genuinely going to help people as opposed to just trying to continue to sell your product.
Lanny (00:17:06)
Oh, absolutely. Empathy is so essential right now and putting yourself in the shoes of audiences, for your product or service. It’s just so essential right now, more than ever, I mean, it’s always essential to think of how your your, your message is going to be received by somebody who might be for instance, hearing him for the first time. But it’s even more essential now.
Brandon (00:17:29)
Yeah, totally. And not to, you know, not to put a highlight on any brands individually. But one piece of content that I personally have really resonated well with has been Nike, where, you know, they’re getting involved and telling people, you know, stay home do the right thing, but they’re doing it in a way that’s also almost empowering their audience, in a way with their messages. You know, if you want to play for millions, now’s your chance stay at home. That’s one that I personally quite like.
Lanny (00:17:56)
I don’t know how you guys are, if your mind readers, or what might be the case. But the two examples that I brought in my head to speak about today, were Nike as a positive example of their, their take home message that they had. And, you know, they’re playing inside play for the world, which is I just thought so perfect, and so authentic to their brand. Because, you know, they’re this like, this aggressive, hard driving brand normally, and, and they managed to actually take a COVID-19 friendly message that’s still authentic to their brand. With the hashtag play inside play for the world. It was fantastic. And the negative example I was going to use of just sort of hollow virtue signaling and empty gestures was the McDonald’s, Brazil separate the arches and social distancing message, which was kind of like the 180 degree wrong way to go about, you know, like, recognizing this environment. So, you know, between you guys, you guys completely must have stolen my notes on this one. But that’s, those are those are perfect examples of sort of how to and how not to.
Brandon (00:19:05)
Yeah, that’s awesome. And a mica from your end. I’m curious when you’ve been working with kind of your your roster of clients, Lani included here. Curious to know, have any of the brands or agencies you’re working with taking a particularly interesting approach to this pandemic? Or has it been sort of in line with everything we’ve communicated so far?
Amika (00:19:25)
Absolutely. So. So with regards to the pandemic, a lot of the clients and agencies and, you know, bear in mind, different verticals, for some have taken quite different approaches. So, from a travel standpoint, obviously, we all know that that is one of the hardest hit verticals in this pandemic, but a really unique thing that some of my clients have taken it with this approach is, you know, again, I think the really key thing right now is just the shift in messaging and being tactful, so you know, working with we’re collaborating in the sense. So working together, trying to find the right messaging, you know, regrouping, and really putting forth a really strong strategy that’s going to get out there. And be tactful in light of the situation that’s going on right now. You know, I’m happy to report that we don’t have any red flags with regards to any sort of messaging that’s going to mark it on my end. And we’d like to keep it that way. Absolutely. To wetland his point was, so yeah, that’s, that’s basically what it is on my end here.
Brandon (00:20:29)
Yeah, that’s great. And then a question out for Lani, just because he’s so involved this, you know, how can PR agency, you know, like national or any of the other ones pivotal role during the current pandemic, that that we’re going through? And then I’m also curious, more, more internally, just for national PR in itself? Have you seen any drastic shifts in how you’re conducting your business? I guess, both internally and with your clients?
Lanny (00:20:59)
I’d be curious to hear how how you guys are handling that as well, actually, I’m looking forward to hearing you discuss that. But to the first part of your question, I think, when you look at client services in general, and you look at the companies that are consultants and providing advice, I think you always go to your clients to being an objective sounding board. One of the advantages of having a consultant in the first place, going to agency in the first place is that you’re free of the internal blind spots that you might have, you’re free of the internal pressures that you might have within the organization, you know, the way we’ve done things, or perhaps internal politics, that sort of thing. So one of the nice things about being a consultant is that you’re always able to provide objective advice, honest advice, you can be a sounding board for your clients during this time. And all those sensitivities we talked about before empathy, and understanding public anxieties at this moment, and having that experience of having a dozen other clients that you can draw from in the back of your mind in terms of, you know, the way that the mood of the public is right now. You can bring all that knowledge and wisdom to your clients and be sometimes a tough, tough love kind of advice for them, perhaps in cases like this, and maybe maybe it is a case of having to say listen, like, I really don’t think that this message is, you know, is going to go over very well right now in this climate. So, you know, I think that agencies in general can, can certainly can certainly play a role. At the same time, they also I mean, you know, in a positive sense, you know, it’s a wonderful opportunity for thinking creatively and thinking of what you can do and thinking of what might be a good opportunity. You know, and I think there’s lots and lots of opportunities for corporate social responsibility right now, in corporate leadership. You know, we’ve all seen those wonderful examples of, and they don’t have to be big to be wonderful. I’m gonna preface this by saying that they don’t have to be large scale, small fashion shops in Toronto, who are making masks, and they’re not making a lot of masks, they’re not going to serve an entire nation. But they’re making some and they’re doing that within the capabilities and talents and skills that they have. And, and that’s, that’s, you know, a real contribution when when rolled out the right way, it’s good for people to know that their clients and stakeholders and all the rest. You know, we saw the hand sanitizer, work that was being done, from distilleries and things like that, like wonderful stories. So there’s opportunities for creativity, right now in this. And it doesn’t have to be all fun. And games can be serious in talent. But I think that consultants have a good role to play in, in identifying opportunities for that sort of thing as well. And again, just having that longer view as well, because at some point, we’re going to be coming out on the other side of this, and that preparation has to happen at some point. And another opportunity for consultants are to think of that past as well. Because when you’re in the middle of this, it’s all consuming, but we are going to be coming out on the other side of it.
Brandon (00:24:08)
Yeah, 100%. And I think, kind of StackAdapt from a value standpoint, is equally aligned, where we still have to conduct a business but more than anything, we’re treating this whole situation and our relationship with our clients the same way we’re doing internally, you know, we’re we’re still going to be there and make almost consultants ative recommendations as everyone’s vendor. But more than that, you know, we’re we’re trying to do more to care about all of our clients as people and really look to your resource for them as people first before we get into helping with them with all their strategy. So the same way we’re doing everything we can for our internal employees to make sure they’ve transitioned as smoothly as possible to the work from home life. We’re trying to do with all of our external clients as well and and so far, I’m really positively Not surprised, but almost not getting either. But just very happy to see how everyone we’re working with both internally and externally is making the most of this situation and understanding that yes, it’s, you know, might be a challenging time right now. But we are going to come out on the other side. And when we do everyone like is going to be better equipped to handle the change in messaging or when we get back in, as opposed to kind of what we’re doing right now. Absolutely.
Amika (00:25:29)
Yeah. That’s a really good point Brandon. And I’m just to piggyback that I almost felt, you know, one thing that I’ve learned, I’ve learned how to pivot very fast. And so I almost took, you know, going back to that consultancy role, I almost had like a PR hat in mid of crisis. And, you know, going back to the education piece and teaching the clients and, you know, being there for them, you know, with any questions that we may have, it wasn’t so much selling, it was more so hearing, understanding, getting on, or Google Hangouts or Zoom conferences, and, you know, putting a face to face, you know, familiar face, and you know, just doing regular tech, and so, yeah, which actually is, you know, a good segue to my next question, because I want to shift back to crisis management. And I want to understand, what are your go to strategies when responding? And how do you isolate the problem, Lanny?
Lanny (00:26:21)
Oh, sure. Well, crisis management, you know, especially from people that come out of politics and end up in, in consulting. I mean, it’s one of the things that politics does prepare you fairly well for is crisis communications. But, you know, I think I think the that’s, that’s certainly a fun part of agency work, too, is that there are opportunities where you’re in those kind of, you know, stressful, but exciting, but important moments, consequential moments where you communicate in a crisis. And so I’ve, you know, I’d be a poor crisis communicator, if I didn’t start by saying that the best time to prepare for your crisis communication is well, before it starts. You know, you dust off that plan that you’ve been revisiting regularly and updating and identified all those folks, people and your plan, right, you have those right. But, of course, in reality, we don’t always have the luxury of, of having those plans made in advance. And I think every time crisis strikes an organization, it’s often the impetus for maybe creating the the crisis plan for next time. But anyway, it’s once you do find yourself in it, you know, it’s of course important not to think of crises as and your response to them rather as like a monolithic thing, it’s not a one time deal, one and done, it’s a process. You, you need to start right away with identifying your various audiences and figuring out which, which audiences near you need to hear what messages what they need to be hearing, at that moment, prioritize that. You have to put yourself in their shoes and understand what they’re coming into in terms of having knowledge of the situation and tailoring that develop your message to element to that, in developing those messages, you need to be direct, they need to show leadership, you need to lead with empathy for the situation, you need to gather all those facts, wrangle them from wherever that you’re getting them from, start with what you know, and not speculate. There. There is a chance, of course, that that further negative elements might come down the line later, you should foreshadow that, because people can handle bad news, but they can’t handle surprises, as I like to say. And of course, then, as you begin to message through the crisis, developing a regular update schedule, sticking to it religiously. And as you start to think about your your media strategy, you should of course, think of the tools that are at your disposal, those instant mediums like Twitter, and Facebook and how you can use those during this as well as official record sources. So you know, that’s kind of your initial wait through as you come out of it. It’s also important people people sometimes forget monitoring, and and of course, a recovery strategy and a brand building or a brand rebuilding, I should say strategy coming out of it too.
Lanny (00:29:09)
So, you know, most crises follow that general path, even though every crisis is distinct. And it’s certainly one of the most thrilling parts of either political communications or agency communications to be to be part of a team that that’s helping either client or a politician or, or someone through that. Yeah, that’s, that’s great. And actually kind of begs the question from my end just because I’m a bit removed. I’d love to learn from both of mica and yourself. How you typically work with StackAdapt to piggyback off of crisis management would love to learn more about you know, the day to day working relationship between yourself and the entire StackAdapt team? A mica included and maybe scenarios where, you know, you typically rely on StackAdapt for quick turnaround in a time sensitive crisis management situation.
Lanny (00:30:00)
Well, you know, I mean, and I won’t, I’ll try not to limit this to crisis in, specifically, but I’ll certainly work from that mindset, you know, I guess, on the platform side of things, you know, I wouldn’t, I wouldn’t be on this podcast if I, if I didn’t really believe in what, in the service you guys offered. I’ve had nothing but good experiences so far working with you guys. And so so first of all, I’ll start with that. But what on the platform side, I mean, the the fact that it’s kind of that blend of self serve, but assistance is available is great, because sometimes during a crisis, or in the aftermath of one, that assistance might become very, might become very valuable. You guys are always really responsive, which is great. But sometimes you’re just you’re just strapped for resources and and the self serve platform is, is pretty easy to work with. But you know, if it came down to needing that extra half an hour back in your day, the fact that you guys have reps to help out with that, with that setup work is, is fantastic. Likewise, the creative studio, depending on the size of the organization that you’re working with, maybe you’re maybe you’re a small company, your sole practitioner, maybe you’re a small company that doesn’t have a house creative team, having that creative studio that can help make the ad look right and formatted properly is a huge value add in times of limited, limited time. And just the ability to draw recorded data out of the platform at any point in time, and update it at 11pm. With data that is accurate as of 11pm. You know, no and no phone calls need to be made no requests or emails need to go in, I can just login and draw that data out whenever the check in time is. Having that full reporting platform is really fantastic. on the administrative side, and, you know, it’s things that are just as important that you don’t think of, but having a simple and straightforward billing process that doesn’t, that doesn’t require a ton of paperwork and complicated approvals. And everything can be done pretty quickly with you know, click and sign online forms and everything. Again, those minutes add up, right, so 15 minutes during a crisis to straighten out an IO and a purchasing system is those minutes matters. And having that having that access to your team is fantastic for that as well. So that’s, that’s all stuff that I appreciated, the faster the pace of the business. And maybe it’s not either crisis, maybe it’s just a, it’s just a really busy week, and having the those kinds of resources just fantastic.
Amika (00:32:49)
Yeah, thank you, Lenny. And for our listeners, I just want to let you all know that I did not pay Lani to say all those things.
Lanny (00:32:58)
That’s true, that’s true.
Amika (00:33:00)
That is from the heart. Just to kind of bridge up what you were saying, Lani. Another thing, especially I think that is very successful. When we run, you know, be in crisis campaigns or campaigns that just need to go up very quickly, from an audience standpoint is then what I also like to lean on, when providing some strategy is our custom audience segments. So being able just to input some key words and key phrases based on you know, the topic at hand, I’m using the browsing behavior, to identify the users that are reading about that topic. And then the look back window is very powerful, right. So, you know, if I’m just going back to the, you know, the topic of crisis, you know, perhaps that crisis is really something that’s in the news for X amount of days, let’s say, you know, three days, and I only want to collect the users for that time, it’s very powerful, and only and owning in on those users that have read about that topic, in that past three days. So I think that’s something that is very measured to be such a successful execution when it comes to, you know, campaigns going up very quickly be a crisis or just regular brand campaigns on that side as well.
Lanny (00:34:09)
Right, I didn’t even get into the into some of the advantages of of the, the targeting systems and everything you guys have in place. I, you know, being in Canada, we, you know, we have privacy laws that are what they are, and they’re, you know, we’re good for good for consumers in the sense that they offer a bit more protection than, than our neighbors do in the States. But it does mean that sometimes the, you know, the the audience targeting available and Canada’s not quite as specific as, as some of our colleagues in the states are used to. But you guys have some really pretty, some really good have some really good options for us that we’ve, that we’ve enjoyed using in terms of finding those niche audiences there.
Brandon (00:34:51)
And I think from there, you know, we could we could probably transition to a lighter closing topic, but first I really want to thank both Lani and mica for participating here. And Lani. I’ve got one final question to you as we sort of wrap up. In our in our planning call over video I noticed about eight bikes in your apartment. They see any trail bikes there were they all rode bikes and I typically like to ride with Toronto.
Lanny (00:35:20)
Yeah, no, you definitely saw a trail bike. I do road gravel and mountain and with kind of my original love being mountain biking and I can’t answer that question because I don’t like to ride in Toronto, I, I actually do everything I can to ride outside of Toronto. So my favorite, my favorite places, and the Don Valley is a fantastic trail system. I just I just like to get out of the city. And so I generally tend to go up to Palgrave Albion Hills for kind of like a faster ride. I love going to Dagmar sometimes, hydro cuttin KW is fantastic. And I’m from Guelph. So I love Wellfleet the trails there are wonderful as well. And a few of the little favorites here and there that that I that I get to I get to keep quiet because they’re they’re my favorite undiscovered places.
Brandon (00:36:21)
For all our listeners outside of Toronto, those are all places that are within two hours, we’re in a pretty metropolitan city with my opinion, not enough green space to go biking. So those are three, I’m a pretty avid biker myself, we should go.
Lanny (00:36:37)
We should go some time we will make after this podcast, we will make plans to go for a ride some time.
Brandon (00:36:42)
That would be great. Love that. In any case, again, I wanted to thank both of you for participating. This was great. And we look forward to speaking together soon and continue working together.
Lanny (00:36:55)
Great. Thanks. Thanks.
Episode Outro (00:36:58)
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